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Post by notmatthew on Jul 30, 2009 13:10:52 GMT -4
Ok, here's the 2250 list that I've been playing in tournaments for the past year or so. My comp has ranged from perfect to mid-level. At the Colonial I got a 13 for comp, but I believe this is because I submitted my armylist WAY too late. I think they gave me a 5 point penalty for this. I was told by mauleed that I deserved around an 18. Please chime in with your opinions. Concessions: Savage on general, I took a BSB, didn't take shaggas, low on fanatics, only one rare choice. Obvious Dings: wyvern, giant. i don't think that my shooting is over the top, please let me know if you disagree.
Savage Orc on wyvern w/ulag's axe, boss hat, and iron gnashas, lt armor, shield night goblin shaman with 2 dispell goblin with wallupa's, trinket, lt. armor, shield on chariot black orc bsb on boar with spirit totem
10 arrer boys 20 savage boys with shields and full command 20 night gobs with bows 1 fanatic muso 20 night gobs with spears 2 fanatics muso 5 wolf riders bow spear muso 5 spider riders bow muso 2 snot bases 2 snot bases
6 savage boar boys standard, muso, war banner, shields, spears 8 squig hoppers spear chukka with bully spear chukka with bully spear chukka with bully spear chukka with bully
giant
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skyth
Junior Member
Posts: 59
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Post by skyth on Jul 30, 2009 13:59:29 GMT -4
Scores a 2309 on the WPS. which translates to about an 8 out of 20. Biggest thing I see is spamming the spear chuckas and the lack of banners.
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Post by notmatthew on Jul 30, 2009 14:30:22 GMT -4
an 8? seriously? last year there were multiple daemons and vamps with around an 8 comp. seems pretty low to me. dropping a spear chukka, adding a pump wagon might help? maybe a standard on each night goblin unit?
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Post by norton on Jul 31, 2009 9:40:31 GMT -4
I kinda agree with Skyth, spamming bolt throwers (even gobbo ones) plus the wyvern gives you plenty of kill potential and then the rest of the list is 2 beatstick units, plus a ton of point denial.
FWIW, I agree your list should score higher, but it's been my opinion that crossroads scores comp harshly.
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Post by mannahnin on Jul 31, 2009 10:20:34 GMT -4
www.crossroads-gt.com/2008results.htmlCrossroads does tend to score somewhat harshly, but 8 is substantially too low, I would say. Robb Kopp’s list was fairly similar, from what I recall, and scored a 12. I believe Miles’ list brought 6 BTs last year and got a 10. (both of those before on-time bonus). I’m not sure if Corey is adjusting the numbers this year considering how older books have been a bit left behind compared to DL, VC, and DE. But even if he isn’t, this list should get at least an 11 or 12. Probably more.
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Post by notmatthew on Jul 31, 2009 11:27:26 GMT -4
I plan to remove one bolt thrower and replace it 1 for 1 with a pump wagon. I am also planning to shift a few inconsequential points around to buy a banner for the night goblins.
To even stand a chance against the latest 6 books I can't really drop the spirit totem or the wyvern unfortunately as all of them have a hard magic phase.
Would two level 2's be comp friendlier over the level 1 and the BSB?
Does having a BSB boost comp? I have found that he is very much a liability in this list and very often gives up his points plus some.
I really dont' care what I get for a score other than I will not bother playing orcs if I am placed in the 'hard' category for the first few games.
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larro
Junior Member
Posts: 98
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Post by larro on Jul 31, 2009 11:38:07 GMT -4
Crossroads does tend to score somewhat harshly, but 8 is substantially too low, I would say. Robb Kopp’s list was fairly similar, from what I recall, and scored a 12. I believe Miles’ list brought 6 BTs last year and got a 10. (both of those before on-time bonus). Rob K runs bricks of Orcs, with Banners. Totally different than this lack of Banner-fest. Moreover, Rob K doesn't have a Wyvern. There are substantial differences. Not necessarily for the better, I admit, and an 8 is too low (and not the "Hard" category either), but I wouldn't expect much higher than an 11 or 12. It's 2 Terror causers, largely worthless units, and a flying rank breaker to boot. The only plus you get from me is no Shagga's Sword on the Wyvern. - Larry
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Post by jchrisobrien on Jul 31, 2009 11:38:54 GMT -4
I don't see your list getting placed in the "hard" category. Hard = 10 or less No need to drop the wyvern or spirit totem in my opinion. It's not like you won't see Empire players with lots of dispel dice, or armies with flying monsters. Don't sell yourself short. O&G definitely have the tools to compete with the newer books, and it is possible to get a low comp score with them. You just have to try harder BSB's don't boost comp by themselves, but sometimes you get bonus VP for having one in the army. They are a no-brainer in some lists (especially with stubborn troops, not something you have to worry about with orcs as much). If you avoid things like 6 bolt throwers and 12 dice of magic, you stand a very good shot of getting a high comp score.
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Post by jchrisobrien on Jul 31, 2009 11:39:39 GMT -4
oh, little things like putting full command on your infantry blocks are also a good way to boost your comp.
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larro
Junior Member
Posts: 98
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Post by larro on Jul 31, 2009 11:41:09 GMT -4
High is a relative term. 2 Terror causers, Bolt Thrower spam, flying Rank Breaker, few Banners - doesn't exactly scream friendly O&G to me. It should end up middle of the pack.
- Larry
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Post by notmatthew on Jul 31, 2009 12:06:09 GMT -4
Ok, let's forget about the initial list posted and focus on the changes I said I'm making : )
that's 5 banners total (BSB, orcs, boar boyz, night gobs, night gobs)
3 bolt throwers (obviously not 'spamming' right?)
yes i have the wyvern, and i'm not bringing a particularly weak list. I'm shooting for 12-14 for comp. I would be happy with 12, way happier for 14.
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larro
Junior Member
Posts: 98
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Post by larro on Jul 31, 2009 12:10:02 GMT -4
If you're asking me, then yes, 5 Banners and less Bolt Throwers = better Comp, and should land you in that range.
- Larry
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Post by mannahnin on Jul 31, 2009 13:26:50 GMT -4
Ah you're right. Rob had boar warboss w/Shagga's, not the Wyvern. It was Birdoff who had the Wyvern. I played them both (at Crossroads and then Conflict), and was misremembering Rob's list slightly.
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larro
Junior Member
Posts: 98
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Post by larro on Jul 31, 2009 13:32:30 GMT -4
Yeah, Birdoff had the "I'm old and don't want to think or paint" version of O&G - 2 Giants, Wyvern, minimum sized Orc units, and some chariots.
- Larry
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nof
Junior Member
Posts: 56
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Post by nof on Jul 31, 2009 15:15:27 GMT -4
I would give the original a 12 and revised a 13. I mean the banners are not huge seeing as you can still flee and neither was the chukka. I dont think the wyvern is too bad seeing as its just a manticore that already failed its frenzy check and has poison instead of killing blow. It is, for the most part (other than all the savagery) a typical orc list with just one more terror causer rather than a brick of orcs. All in all I like the list.
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